Buget panel upgrade. Am I on the right track.

[UrbanM]

Hi,
I fly a 6A finished in 2006. As you can see in the picture the panel is dated and its time for an upgrade. I started pricing out a full Garmin EFIS compliment and quit when I got past 18K and that was with my old comm and TX. Not that I'm after a budget panel but the plane is used strictly for VFR and I would be afraid of the downtime of ripping out the entire panel and starting over. It took nearly a year during COVID to get my engine back due to parts availability so downtime is a thing with me.
I would like to first replace the vintage 496 with a Garmin 660. Unfortunately this takes up some valuable real estate . I the last picture is the paper template for an Air Gismo mount for the 660 which obviously covers a lot more territory of the 496 . I figure I can replace the airspeed, altimeter, and VSI with a Garmin G5 and free up some room but that leaves the control head for the Tru Track AP. The AP is driven in roll only off of the 496. I don't use this feature much but it is nice to have on long XC flights. I could possibly move the Tru Track to where the VSI is currently or possibly upgrade to a 2 axis AP with a smaller controller. In the records that came with the airplane were receipts for every nut and bolt including the True Track and I was a bit surprised how expensive it was for 20 years ago. I understand some autopilots can be operated straight from the instruments like the G5. Right now everything works well and I'm hoping to minimize downtime and move into this decade. Is there anything else I should consider before attempting this upgrade?
Thanks,
Kirk

 

[Mike S]

I started pricing out a full Garmin EFIS compliment and quit when I got past 18K and that was with my old comm and TX.
Kirk

You might take a look at GRT.

My last panel (2020) cost apx $13k for dual 10.1 screens, Trig xpnder with ADSB, Trig comm, and assorted peripherals like magnetometer, GPS etc.

Also, GRT will play nice with the TruTrak.

Prices have most likely gone up, but I have no idea how much.

 

[PaulvS]

If all you really need is the Aera 660 and space for the airgizmo is a problem then an alternative is to mount the Aera in a smaller custom tray. The Garmin aviation mount holds it securely anyway and the tray is to make it flush and tidy up the appearance. That is what a buddy of mine did and it turned out well. Sorry I don't have a pic!

 

[TigerMan92]

My 7A took it's first flight in January 2007 with a VFR panel built by Chief Aircraft for 22k. I was facing the same problem of wanting to update my panel but not spend a fortune. I was having intercom problems so I chose to remove my SL40 and intercom and put in a GTR200B radio. In place of the intercom I put a Stratus power port. I also changed the transponder from analog to a GTX327. ADSB provided by uAvionix . I also just purchased a GMU11 and two G5's one for the ADI and one for the DG. I'm working on the wiring harness now.
The G5's will be totally separate from the Digitrak AP and Altrak VS. The Digitrak is connected to the KMD150 GPS/MFD and will fly flight plans. This will keep me updated for a reasonable price and still only VFR which is all I fly.

 

[Kyle Boatright]

Question - do the GRT EFIS's have integral GPS? My first pass through the literature didn't find a reference, so I'm guessing the answer is no. I do see the ADSB compliant add-on modules, but that's not what I'm asking about.

 

[AN23]

I 'm not sure this will help you but maybe it'll give you some ideas. Our RV-8 was pretty much a round dial airplane with a Garmin 796 on a suction cup mount. I hated it. Just didn't look good plus I had no EMS. I purchased a used EMS D-10 which got rid of all of the engine related gages. I then had Bill at Up North Aviation help me design a new panel that included panel mounting the 796. I can't speak highly enough of Bill. We went through several iterations before finally settling on one. We ordered a new blank panel and had it sent to Bill where he cut it and sent it to me. I have a later Tru-Track so it includes airspeed, attitude and altitude. The round dials are for backup. The panel was hydro-dipped for a carbon fiber look and a custom (very simple) panel mount tray was fabricated for the 796. We now have a VERY capable (synthetic vision, charts, ADS-B in and out, etc.) airplane that functions perfectly.

 

[rmd]

Question - do the GRT EFIS's have integral GPS? My first pass through the literature didn't find a reference, so I'm guessing the answer is no. I do see the ADSB compliant add-on modules, but that's not what I'm asking about.

I have recently replaced two GRT Horizon WS (2006 original installation) displays with two GRT Horizon EX displays in our RV-7A. These are the 7-ish inch displays. The 1st Horizon EX went in around January of 2023 and the 2nd one was installed in December of 2023. Both have an internal VFR GPS. They're not legal for the GPS source for ADS-B.

When I was buying the display for the January 2023 installation I read the manual and found information that said it did not come with the internal GPS. So, if you happen across that in your research, feel free to ignore it. The internal GPS works great and locks onto satellites much quicker than my Garmin GNC-300XL. I can often get a lock while still in the steel hangar (with the hangar door open).

Regards,
Rob
Partner in N706DR

 

[Dugaru]

I have recently replaced two GRT Horizon WS (2006 original installation) displays with two GRT Horizon EX displays in our RV-7A.

I replaced one WS with a Horizon EX. It has its own GPS (and comes with an antenna). As you note, it’s not legally usable as an IFR navigator or as a GPS source for ADS-B, but as a practical matter it’s been rock solid. Really happy with it.

 

[UrbanM]

Thanks everyone for the replies! I checked the basic dimensions of the 660 VS the 496 and the height difference is only 1/5 of an inch. I'm thinking I can grind this out of the panel and use the cradle and wires set up found here https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/avpages/garmin10-06028.php and bolt to the existing metal bracket the holds the 496 mount. I'll wait on the G5 till winter.
Kirk

 

[PaulvS]

Thanks everyone for the replies! I checked the basic dimensions of the 660 VS the 496 and the height difference is only 1/5 of an inch. I'm thinking I can grind this out of the panel and use the cradle and wires set up found here https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/avpages/garmin10-06028.php and bolt to the existing metal bracket the holds the 496 mount. I'll wait on the G5 till winter.
Kirk

Yep that should work. If you want to have it mounted on a recessed bracket so as to make the Aera flush with the panel then you would need to grind a couple of small openings to reach the power button that is on the side and maybe the release latch, with your finger. If instead the back of the Aera is mounted on the surface of the panel then no grinding should be necessary. The Aera is a bit thinner than the 496 anyway. Once you have the Aera and the aviation bare wire cradle I'm sure you can figure it out.

 

[UrbanM]

Thanks again for the replies and pictures of the nice panels. Quick question regarding the Audio on the 660; The old 496 was pipped into the intercom via these two devices (Pictured). The 660 wiring schematic shows dedicated wires for audio. Can I wire the harness straight to the intercom or do I need these two devices (The second one looks like a power supply for the first). Or, can I use Bluetooth to pipe the audio straight to my headsets?
I currently use the Ipad for BT and don't mind going this route but in case I switch to some other headset or fly with someone with vintage headsets it might be nice to have a hard wired audio.
Thanks for any insights!
Kirk

 

[Snowflake]

Get the bare wire harness for the 660 and wire it into everything. Audio into the intercom (or your aux in on the radio), data into the radio so you can get frequencies transferred, etc.

 

[BobTurner]

Something I didn’t see, but since you mentioned ‘down time’. This idea is not original with me. Vans will sell you, cheap, a blank aluminum panel. Cut it, wire it, as much as possible on the bench. You can still fly with your current panel. When ready, remove the old, install the new, along with avionics you’re keeping. With some forethought this can significantly cut your downtime.

 

[blaplante]

Here's some random thoughts:
Your TruTrak servos will work with a variety of TruTrak AP control heads. Some of those are available in 2.25" round, which you have a lot of places that it could move to.
The TruTrak can be driven by just about any GPS, you already own the servos, I wouldn't rush to toss it.

I think the best bang for freeing up space would be to put in a JPI EDM 350 engine monitor. Tach, MP, RPM, CHT, EGT, OP, OT, OAT etc. in one box that fits a 3" hole.
We've figured out alternative senders for it that will save you considerable. They want $270 for the oil pressure sender. Can be done for less than half that. $175 for OAT, when you just need type K thermocouple for under $20.