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Announcement: RV-10 parts will be transitioning to final-sized matched holes

greghughespdx

Well Known Member
Advertiser
Over the next several months, we will be transitioning RV-10 kits parts to final-sized matched holes (they are currently a slightly-undersized matched-hole design). We're excited to make this enhancement available to builders and shave some build time off their projects as a result. Details are at the link below. There's no price increase associate with this change.

https://www.vansaircraft.com/2020/07/vans-announces-plan-to-move-to-final-size-holes-on-rv-10-kits/

I guess I should have waited to buy my fuselage kit!
 
Yeah. But I should be done with my emp by the time this goes into affect. I am really tickled with this announcement.
 
This is great news! It'll knock probably 100-200 hours off the -10 build time!

This may be a dumb question but what do you do if you have a final sized part that needs to mate to a non-final-sized part? Do you a) cleco and drill as before and accept any sort of misalignment or b) final drill the part and assume it will work?

Will the instructions be updated? If so, please integrate the aileron SB changes and fix the fuel tank section.

Once the transition is complete does that mean the kits will have all final-sized parts? I'm planning on ordering the fuse next year and will happily wait another month or three to make sure that's the case!
 
Over the next several months, we will be transitioning RV-10 kits parts to final-sized matched holes (they are currently a slightly-undersized matched-hole design). We're excited to make this enhancement available to builders and shave some build time off their projects as a result. Details are at the link below. There's no price increase associate with this change.

https://www.vansaircraft.com/2020/07/vans-announces-plan-to-move-to-final-size-holes-on-rv-10-kits/

Any other company would have increased the price for saving build time. WAY TO GO VAN! Might be a convenient excuse to build another RV10.
 
Wow, what a time saver!

After building almost all of a 12, I can say that it was a delight not to have to go the cleco everything together, up-drill, pull everything apart, deburr, clean, put it back together and finally rivet. It was one of the things I dreaded.

You check the holes to see if you need to deburr (doesn't happen often), cleco and rivet!

Another thank you to Van's!

Bob
 
The next offering from Van should be pre-dimple holes. When this happen, a builder just has to cleco and rivet. Since the CNC machine already drill the hole, it is one more step to dimple it. I'll pay extra for this service.

This is one of the reason many production airplanes use standard rivets instead of flush rivets is the added labor involved in dimple the skin and the substructure.
 
It is amazing to me how many people want an Amateur-Built Airplane, but don't want to build it.

BTW, this will probably require a new FAA evaluation for the 51% kit approval.
 
It is amazing to me how many people want an Amateur-Built Airplane, but don't want to build it.

BTW, this will probably require a new FAA evaluation for the 51% kit approval.

Hang on, Mel. There are huge benefits that are gained from building (custom plane, custom panel, custom paint, etc, etc, etc) ....but repeating the same tasks 10,000 times is not one of them! So, shaving 100-200 hours of mindless repetition should be welcome news for everyone but the person interested in spending as much time as possible on the build and away from the honey-do list! ;)
 
It is amazing to me how many people want an Amateur-Built Airplane, but don't want to build it.

Here's where the FAA cracks me up though. In order to for it to be experimental you have to build it but if it's a kit you might have to check for 51% rule, yet you can't get any credit for your A&P certificate for fabricating a plane. HHMMMM?

I'm in that group who wants and owns experimentals and would like to build them but recognize my limitations. If I had the ability to fabricate parts like others do I would do it and go study and take classes and get my A&P. I don't have that ability so I forget about the A&P but I still buy experimental aircraft because I do have some ability and I can fix things myself with limited supervision.
 
It is amazing to me how many people want an Amateur-Built Airplane, but don't want to build it.

Some of us build so we can afford the plane we want, not because we want to expend as much energy as possible building.

Still more of us build for "education", which is the main the purpose of the category. How much was I educated by match-drilling 10,000 holes? Don't get me wrong, it adds to the sense of accomplishment, and I'm sure I'll enjoy looking down my nose at the people who opted for this option because I did it "the old fashioned way", but in reality, I'll just be jealous.

Did you walk uphill both ways in the snow to your shop while you were building, too? :D
 
Some of us build so we can afford the plane we want, not because we want to expend as much energy as possible building.

Still more of us build for "education", which is the main the purpose of the category. How much was I educated by match-drilling 10,000 holes? Don't get me wrong, it adds to the sense of accomplishment, and I'm sure I'll enjoy looking down my nose at the people who opted for this option because I did it "the old fashioned way", but in reality, I'll just be jealous.

Did you walk uphill both ways in the snow to your shop while you were building, too? :D


This new Forum needs a LIKE button to save time and storage space!! :D:D:D
 
....How much was I educated by match-drilling 10,000 holes? Don't get me wrong, it adds to the sense of accomplishment....

Your kit had holes that came already located and prepunched? Wow!

Now, back in my day, young man.....

Seriously, though, this a hugely welcome change. Good for Van's.

Dave
RV-3B, now on the canopy
 
Since I already have all the major kits that have to be match drilled I will some day be able to tell those d**n kids to get off my lawn too!
 
Here's where the FAA cracks me up though. In order to for it to be experimental you have to build it but if it's a kit you might have to check for 51% rule, yet you can't get any credit for your A&P certificate for fabricating a plane. HHMMMM?

I'm in that group who wants and owns experimentals and would like to build them but recognize my limitations. If I had the ability to fabricate parts like others do I would do it and go study and take classes and get my A&P. I don't have that ability so I forget about the A&P but I still buy experimental aircraft because I do have some ability and I can fix things myself with limited supervision.

You have to remember that an A&P is not an aircraft god - the license allows you to do maintenance according to established procedures and manuals. Yes, you learn techniques of fabrication, but just barely - the riveting section of an A&P test could be passed by anyone that has assembled a Van’s toolbox, and that is way, way down on the eventual learning curve of someone that finishes an RV.

The bottom line is that building and maintaining are two separate skills that inform each other, but don’t map directly together.
 
...The bottom line is that building and maintaining are two separate skills that inform each other, but don’t map directly together.

Paul has it right.

Also, inspection is another distinct skill that doesn't necessarily overlap the others, although we wish it did.
Dave
 
You have to remember that an A&P is not an aircraft god - the license allows you to do maintenance according to established procedures and manuals. ....The bottom line is that building and maintaining are two separate skills that inform each other, but don’t map directly together.

Yet a person can take a 16 hour class and get a repairman certificate to maintain, repair and inspect an LSA. Mind boggling.
 
Only the one they built themselves.

That's incorrect. The FAA Repairman Certificate is for any Experimental Light Sport Aircraft which you own or one you purchase in the future, and you can do a course in a weekend. You don't have to be the builder and you can even do Condition Inspections. Not only that, there's no renewal either !

Now if you want to get fancy you can get in just 15 days the Repairman-Maintenance rating and then you can perform maintenance and inspections on anyone’s S-LSA or E-LSA and charge for your services. BAMM !

And finally the kicker: Get that Repairman-Maintenance rating in 2 weeks then work on aircraft for 30 months under YOUR OWN SUPERVISION and take that to the FAA for permission to take the A&P tests. INCREDIBLE but as you see building a plane is way more involved than a 2 week course and you still can't use building the plane for a A&P test. I stand by my initial comment.
 
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Impact on empanage?

Will longeron and stringer mating prepunched holes be undersized for match drilling?
Just curious.
 
...

This may be a dumb question but what do you do if you have a final sized part that needs to mate to a non-final-sized part? Do you a) cleco and drill as before and accept any sort of misalignment or b) final drill the part and assume it will work?


I am now wondering the same thing. I just received my empennage kit. The build instructions don't include any specific guidance. There was a single sheet insert in the instructions that some parts may not be final sized, but it doesn't say what to do if one part is and the mating part isn't. I'm worried about over-sizing the part that has the final-sized holes.

I after finishing the inventory, all of my skins are final sized. 3/4 of the ribs are not. Debating just taking a straight flute reamer to the undersized parts without clecoing them to the skins first.
 
I used a piloted reamer on most of my pre-punched, slightly undersized holes. Very little deburring required. If holes are ‘right sized’, you may just need a pass with a scotch-brite pad prior to dimple. Huge time saver, and over deburring isn’t a problem.
 
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