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DID YOU KNOW insurance is forever changing?

LRingeisen

Well Known Member
Insurance changes constantly. We know 2019 has been a tough year for all of us adjusting to the higher premiums and tighter insurance guidelines, but we want to continue to keep you informed of some of the changes we have been made aware of. A couple of things we have noticed lately is that deductibles are starting to reappear. This isn?t to lower rates, but instead to make the insurance companies more comfortable insuring low time pilots, specifically on tailwheel aircraft. We haven?t seen much of this yet, but it has happened. Another thing we?ve noticed is that the RV-8/RV-8A have been getting more difficult to insure. Companies typically want to see pilots with at least 25 hours in the make and model. We?re not saying that you can?t get a quote if you have less hours than that, but we want you to know that it is easier if you do.

We?re not the only one?s trying to help you. Some of our insurance companies want to give you some tips and tricks of how to keep insurance costs down and how to make it easier to get the best policy available. Below is a link form Global Aerospace. With their permission, we wanted to pass this article along to anyone who may not have seen it. There is some good information in it.

Just remember, quotes are only valid for 60-90 days depending on the insurance company, because insurance is forever changing. :)

https://www.global-aero.com/insurin...utm_medium=blog&utm_campaign=insurancehurdles
 
Just curious, if insurance company wanted 25 hours in the type, could you just fly your airplane around for 25 hours uninsured before applying for a policy?
 
Just curious, if insurance company wanted 25 hours in the type, could you just fly your airplane around for 25 hours uninsured before applying for a policy?

Yes, you could do that. Of course we don't recommend or suggest doing so, but if you came to a broker with 25 hours in the make and model, you shouldn't be required to have any dual training.
 
I ended up renewing with Global. While perusing the new Policy, I noticed page 2 contained an offer for 1 year of free Savvy Aviation Aircraft Breakdown Assistance.

You are correct. Global offered the Savvy coverage on a trial basis and had so much positive feedback that they decided to continue. For now the additional perk is still included on most of their policies.
 
Just curious, if insurance company wanted 25 hours in the type, could you just fly your airplane around for 25 hours uninsured before applying for a policy?

This is essentially the route that we are having to take with the Subsonex. I was fortunate that I earned the rating in the factory jet because I was a journalist, so I had three hours in type when I went to insure my jet - but that didn?t mean diddly to insurance companies with respect to hull coverage. no one would bid. I was able to get liability for a hefty price this first year. When renewal comes around next spring, and I have collected many more hours in type, we?ll see if that makes a difference - I am most curious.

Other builders don?t get to fly the factory jet for their rating training (ironically enough, because Sonex can?t get insurance....), so they?ll have ZERO hours in type to start.

So...sometimes you just have to take a risk and self-insure the hull in some cases.
 
This is essentially the route that we are having to take with the Subsonex. I was fortunate that I earned the rating in the factory jet because I was a journalist, so I had three hours in type when I went to insure my jet - but that didn?t mean diddly to insurance companies with respect to hull coverage. no one would bid.

That's kinda frightening with a >$100k investment, especially when you're uninsured during the flyoff phase - probably your highest risk period from a hull loss perspective. Is that common knowledge in the Sonex jet community?
 
That's kinda frightening with a >$100k investment, especially when you're uninsured during the flyoff phase - probably your highest risk period from a hull loss perspective. Is that common knowledge in the Sonex jet community?

Not really all that uncommon. I ran into similar situation with my Moose. Only a few would take, and their requirements were unreasonable, ?25 hours with a DPE who has 250 hours in type.? Try insuring a floatplane if you want a good laugh. They might bite if you?re willing to drop $15k a year....
 
If you don?t ?qualify? from an insurance perspective but have the licensure can one find liability only? Otherwise is someone forced to fly ?naked? until they get the hours.
 
I?m having a hard time believing people are flying their 100k planes uninsured. Would love to hear some more comments
 
I don't doubt that "flying naked" happens but...

...here in Virginia it would be illegal. You can't fly a Virginia aircraft without a license from the state. That costs only $5 (!) and you get a nice sticker. It sounds like a bargain, but to get your $5 license you need to show that you've paid sales/use tax, you need to tell them where the aircraft is based so they can pass that off to the property tax folks (who will promptly bill you of course), AND you need to show proof of liability insurance.

What if I want to fly a Subsonex (such a cool plane) and can't get insurance? Turns out that's no problem!! I just need to deposit $250,000--cash--with the state aviation folks. Or (assuming I have really really good credit) it looks like I can obtain and give them $250,000 in "irrevocable letters of credit from a depository institution."

There's a lot to be said for flying small planes in Virginia, but the authorities are very very serious about getting their proof of insurance and $.


I?m having a hard time believing people are flying their 100k planes uninsured. Would love to hear some more comments
 
That's kinda frightening with a >$100k investment, especially when you're uninsured during the flyoff phase - probably your highest risk period from a hull loss perspective. Is that common knowledge in the Sonex jet community?

Sure, I expect everyone on the Subsonex community (all thirty or so...) know the score. It’s something to check before you buy if its on your concern list.

Personally, I’m more concerned with the liability side of flying without insurance. .

Liability seems to be available, and as I mentioned in my post, I purchased it even though its pretty high priced. I’m hoping that goes down with the added hours from a year’s flying.

I’m having a hard time believing people are flying their 100k planes uninsured. Would love to hear some more comments

Not sure what more you’d want to hear. Some people feel that life is dependent on insurance, others don't. It’s a choice we make along with the hundreds or thousands of other choices that go in to building and owning an airplane....or anything, frankly. You do what is comfortable for you in your situation.
 
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I’m having a hard time believing people are flying their 100k planes uninsured. Would love to hear some more comments

A whole lot of float plane pilots in AK are flying 100k planes uninsured as float insurance in AK is stupid expensive.

It's not unlike people that have 100k into a race car, those aren't insured either.

I flew my cessna 170 in AK for 100 hours before I insured it. After I had 100 hours in type, the insurance was reasonable. It's opened up the doors for some more cross country flying and going through Canada. Previously I was very careful about only flying in very good weather. Not that I fly in poor weather now, but the airplane is more useful when you aren't super careful to only fly on calm/sunny days.

schu
 
It all depends on your personal financial position, for the plane I could take the loss, it is a known thing. However for liability I will take every bit that someone will sell me.

I really can't get out of a claim that I personally have put into the plane. Also the air frame could be declared a total loss but the engine and electronics might be fully recoverable. I would end up having to buy my own plane back, this is a very common thing.

The side effect is it makes you think hard about being careful. And if I do total the airframe, then I just get to build better plane.

I have this zen like thing every time I get in a plane, "I will be safe, I will not hurt this airplane"
 
I have this zen like thing every time I get in a plane, "I will be safe, I will not hurt this airplane"

Please change this. People have died trying to ?save the airplane?, rather than saving themselves (e.g., refused to land in a field, tried to make the airport.) One psychological but important reason, for some, for carrying insurance, is that it makes the decision to sacrifice the airplane easier.
 
Happens way more than you may think

I’m having a hard time believing people are flying their 100k planes uninsured. Would love to hear some more comments

This happens all the time. I can list 10 pilots right now flying a $150K to $200K plane without insurance. Particularly with twins. . . Some 20 years ago when I bought a 310 the insurance was through the roof. At that time the airplane was worth maybe $75K and my insurance was $6500/yr. I paid that for 2 years and it only went down to $5900/yr. After the 2nd year I accepted the that I would be better off self insuring that plane. I ended up investing another $90K in to that plane and flew it for 11 more years without insurance. In the certified GA community, no insurance is not that uncommon because the annual insurance cost is many time 1/10th or 1/15th the value of the plane.
 
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