What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

Pneumatic vs Cordless Tools

BertP

I'm New Here
I'm still in the wannabe phase but I have a question about tools. What is the advantage (if any) of using pneumatic tools for everything on a build? I understand the use of pneumatic rivet guns but what about drills? There is a ton of very good cordless drills out there and it would seem to me that one of them would be preferable to pneumatic. Any suggestions? I am in Canada and I just checked Aircraft Spruce's website: almost $4500 for the Van's tool kit!! Yikes!

Thanks

Bert
 
Bert, I don't think I touched my two pnumatic drills for the last half of my build. Cordless drills worked great, especially with the reamers that I used on the prepunched kit.
 
Tools

I'm still in the wannabe phase but I have a question about tools. What is the advantage (if any) of using pneumatic tools for everything on a build? I understand the use of pneumatic rivet guns but what about drills? There is a ton of very good cordless drills out there and it would seem to me that one of them would be preferable to pneumatic. Any suggestions? I am in Canada and I just checked Aircraft Spruce's website: almost $4500 for the Van's tool kit!! Yikes!

Thanks

Bert

Welcome Bert
Both have a place and both subject to builder preference.
Personally, I like the Sioux drill for drilling aluminum but also keep a cordless for final drilling with a reamer or for a second size bit. Aluminum is supposed to be drilled at high speed. Steel is slow. That said, lots of builders use only one or the other.
No need to shell out for the super deluxe kit. Look for used. Hook up with a local chapter and a mentor. Learn on their tools so you have a better ide of what you want to buy.
 
Pneumatic drills turn considerably faster than most cordless drills. This gives you faster holes.

Of course my own experience is with an RV-3B project that didn't come pre-punched, so I've got lots of holes to drill. I find that pneumatic drills are worth while and keep three on hand. One for a #30 bit, one for a #40 bit and one for the bit that I need at the moment.

Dave
 
Primary reason is that they are much faster. In addition to that though, pneumatic drills are smaller, lighter, and don't go dead. Also, I've had issues with consumer grade cordless drill chucks actually spinning true when dealing with the small drill bits we use here. YMMV on that though.

I have two of the Pan American pneumatic drills that Bob Avery used to sell, one for each size 30 and 40 bits. It's MUCH easier to swap drills than it is to swap bits. I also use a dewalt 12v mainly for countersinking where you need to go slower. Most of the time when I need a size other than #30 or #40, I use the cordless.
 
There are many advantage to pneumatic tools, but to address your specific reference to drills. Drilling the aluminum ideally requires the high speed rotation that an air drill offers. I think my Sioux drill spins at 6000 rpm. I don't think an electric drill comes even close to that. Also, the good air drills, like Sioux, have very precise bit alignment for close tolerance in drilling holes. Also, I strongly recommend getting a large compressor, 60 gal., so you don't have to listen to it recycle so often.

You will spend a good deal of money on tools. Spend more on the ones that require quality and not so much on the ones that don't. You can't go wrong ordering from Mike at Cleaveland tool.
 
Last edited:
Welcome to VAF!

Bert, welcome to VAF.:D

Another cordless devotee here, the air drill lays abandoned (almost) in its drawer.

One factor in my case is that I really hate the sound of the air compressor, so if you plan to use the air tools a lot, consider the compressor you will use, and where it is located.
 
I used a Ryobi cordless (4# or so) and a Sioux pneumatic (under 2#). The Sioux is MUCH faster, lighter. more comfortable and fits into smaller spaces. If you're just drilling a few holes, the cordless is fine. If you're drilling or reaming a few hundred at a time (wing and fuselage skins, longerons, etc) the Sioux is a much nicer option. Either one will build a plane.

I also have a $40 Northern Tool 1800 RPM pneumatic drill. It was really a waste of money. The Sioux was much more expensive at nearly $200, but worth every penny I paid for it.
 
Have both, haven't touched the pneumatic one since mid way through the wings. It could be that I have a crappy one but I can't tell the difference as mostly you are reaming and crazy high speed matters less.

I have the Milwaukee 12v 3/8 drill/driver and 3 batteries, one always on the charger, one charged, one in the tool. I could probably star in a Milwaukee Tool ad at this point as I love the thing. Much lighter than the 18v version, works like a champ.

My only complaint is one already mentioned above, the chuck isn't particularly true when it comes to the #40 bit, but not enough of an issue to matter.
 
I started out using pneumatic only (10 years ago) but by the end on my build in 2013 battery technology was so good that the angle grinder and rivet gun became the only pneumatic tools to be consistently press into service.
 
welcome x2 !

Bert,
understandably you don't show much personal stuff in your profile, but drop a hint which province or city you are in, or look up in the Rv white pages, there is someone finishing an RV every 38 minutes now!?........ :) so there should be tons of tool sets up for sale....especially if you fish around a bit! Ask at your local flying club or RAA chapter too, there are guys downsizing etc. that need to clean out their garage/hangar, and just need some incentive ( $$$)
the bonus; these guys have found which bucking bars work, how many clecos you Really need, built wing cradles, benches... etc. etc....so you aren't buying/building unneeded stuff.
happy building!
 
Both

I have a compact air drill that I've used for 40 years. I used it extensively on the aluminum work. Now on FWF, not so much. It is smaller and with the super flexible hose kit from Cleaveland, it will reach in tight areas others won't fit. The control/balance is better, speed and position.

I am on my third cordless drill in 12 years. It certainly has a place, and gets used a lot for functions needing torque control, like step drills, hole saws, micro stop counter sinks. The extra drill with a countersink really comes in handy for work efficiency.

I thought an pneumatic angle drill would not be needed. I was wrong. I found a good one on eBay for .10 on the dollar, and after using it in difficult positions and locations, consider that a must too.

3000 rpm is fast enough for our drills.

You can choose what your tradeoffs are, but as you get going, the efficiency of a work session may become important to you.

Have you taken an RV sheet metal training course? That might help you get the feel of this.
 
Thanks for all of the replies. I guess there's more to it than meets the eye.

I don't have a lot of metal working experience - a bit here and a bit there. Nor have I built an aircraft yet. A little bit at a time, I guess :)

Bert
 
I started the same way. NO experience with metal, or building much of anything besides computers (they don't count for most stuff like this). I was living in Dallas when I started and we went to one of those 'How-To-Build' an RV classes. It was great because it gave me the confidence to do the kit build.
You'll find most EAA chapters have someone that's built an RV that can get you going in the right direction. Start there.

For me, there was still a lot of head scratching and like many, the hardest part of the kit (RV-9 emp) was drilling the first hole. The second hardest was drilling out my first bad rivet (which wasn't terribly far behind the first one).

Now, I'm working on an RV-12 and man is it easy! Although I still scratch my head from time to time.

Bob
 
I started the same way. NO experience with metal, or building much of anything besides computers (they don't count for most stuff like this). I was living in Dallas when I started and we went to one of those 'How-To-Build' an RV classes. It was great because it gave me the confidence to do the kit build.
You'll find most EAA chapters have someone that's built an RV that can get you going in the right direction. Start there.

For me, there was still a lot of head scratching and like many, the hardest part of the kit (RV-9 emp) was drilling the first hole. The second hardest was drilling out my first bad rivet (which wasn't terribly far behind the first one).

Now, I'm working on an RV-12 and man is it easy! Although I still scratch my head from time to time.

Bob

Well put Bob
 
I started the same way. NO experience with metal, or building much of anything besides computers (they don't count for most stuff like this). I was living in Dallas when I started and we went to one of those 'How-To-Build' an RV classes. It was great because it gave me the confidence to do the kit build.
You'll find most EAA chapters have someone that's built an RV that can get you going in the right direction. Start there.

For me, there was still a lot of head scratching and like many, the hardest part of the kit (RV-9 emp) was drilling the first hole. The second hardest was drilling out my first bad rivet (which wasn't terribly far behind the first one).

Now, I'm working on an RV-12 and man is it easy! Although I still scratch my head from time to time.

Bob
That sounds like excellent advice and I am toying with an idea that may not fly (pardon the pun).

I came across an aircraft that has been fairly badly damaged in a very poorly executed abandoned takeoff (it ran off the end of the runway). If I go this route, I plan on approaching it as an aircraft that will never fly again so the best I will get out of it is some parts to sell. But, it will give me some experience working with metal as I tear it apart to see if it can be fixed and, if it can, putting it back together again (under close supervision, of course).

It's an idea, at least. How good an idea, I don't know so if anyone has any suggestions, I'm open to any and all :)

Bert
 
Hi Bert,
I have built two aluminum aircraft now with the same set of princess auto air drills. They are cheap and seem to run on and on if you keep the oil flowing. Same with the rivet puller. When it come to setting rivets, that's where quality pays with precise trigger action. I'm finished building for a while but you are welcome to drive down to Stettler for a flight and intro to the family of RVs.
Cam Andres
RV9A with IO360
Stettler
CEJ3
 
Hi Bert,
I have built two aluminum aircraft now with the same set of princess auto air drills. They are cheap and seem to run on and on if you keep the oil flowing. Same with the rivet puller. When it come to setting rivets, that's where quality pays with precise trigger action. I'm finished building for a while but you are welcome to drive down to Stettler for a flight and intro to the family of RVs.
Cam Andres
RV9A with IO360
Stettler
CEJ3

That's a very generous offer, Cam, thank you. I just might take you up on the offer!

Thanks also for the suggestion of Princess Auto. I hadn't even thought of them.

Bert
 
I really prefer my Sioux pneumatic drill. It's light and works great. I had a cheaper one before but my trigger finger was getting sore. Spend your money on a good drill up front. You will be drilling literally hundreds of holes. Most of the cordless drills are pretty heavy. I do use mine from time to time when I don't feel like turning on the compressor for a couple of holes. I have the quick change chuck from Cleveland Tools it works great and it allows you to not need to buy more than one drill.
 
Like others, started with pneumatic but tried an cordless. Once I tried the cordless, I ended up building 90% of the airplane with the cordless. For me, once I tied cordless, I never went back.

Just like primer, position of the little wheel, and canopy type, each person will have their own preference. IMHO, you will need to try both to figure out what is best for you.
 
tools

I have pneumatic and cordless drills and one Dremel electric cut off tool. The cordless drill works most of the time but if you have a lot of holes to do, the pneumatic is lighter and smaller footprint. Both the cordless drill and the pneumatic has quickchange chucks which is a must. I have two air operated zizwheels (angle grinder and straight grinder). The angle gets the most work out with the scotch-bright pads for deburing and several carbide bits for radius stuff. The straight grinder keeps a cutoff wheel in it for quick work. I did add a Dremel electric cut-off wheel to the collection for cutting the canopy (with the special Dremel cut-off wheel for plastic) and it was fantastic and I have since used it for other cutting needs. It has more torque and can go a lot more distance than the air operated cut off wheel. A shot of marvel mystery before and after use keeps the air tools fresh.
cj
 
I have both, but in reality the only time I use my pneumatic drill is when the battery is dead on my cordless, or I have close-quarters spot that my cordless won't get into.

I spent a little more on the lightweight lithium-ion battery on my cordless (they were relatively new at the time I started my project 8 years ago and nickel-cadmium was the standard) and it was definitely worth it. The cordless gives the freedom of movement without an air hose attached and the battery life is phenomenal.

They both have a place in the shop - but my cordless has a higher place. :D
 
When I started my latest project, I pulled out my old pneumatic drill and prepared to drill thousands of holes in round aluminum tubing. I also had a 18v Makita cordless drill on the bench.

I used the air drill for about an hour before deciding I was tired of dragging around the hose especially since the Makita on the high speed setting did a fine job of making airplane holes. The remainder of the plane was built with the Makita. I suspect I'll never use the air drill again.
 
Back
Top