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DID YOU KNOW insurance companies can have a rate change at anytime?

LRingeisen

Well Known Member
With the continuing changes to the aviation insurance market, we have been receiving more and more questions from our clients. The main question has been, ?How much will my rate increase??. The answer isn?t as simple as it seems. We only know what the rates are going to be for the next 60 days or so. At any point, the insurance companies can come back with a rate adjustment. So if you are looking for renewal quotes on a policy over 60 days from now, all we can tell you is what we are seeing the market do AT THIS TIME. With that being said, we are seeing increases up to 25% for Vans aircraft. The hardest hit seem to be the Vans RV-10, RV-12, and the RV-8. The insurance companies are becoming more strict on these aircraft.

We still shop our renewals to all of our companies, but we no longer have as many competitive companies for Vans. This especially goes for pilots over the age of 70. If you are getting close to this age, make sure you get with a company that works well for older pilots prior to it being too late. Another thing to keep in mind is, as long as the insurance brokers are provided the same information, all brokers get the same quotes. With some companies, they will only release one quote and then all other brokers get blocked. Gallagher works with all companies that write Vans so we have a good understanding of which companies work best with individual situations. Remember that finding the best price may not be the same as finding the best value.
 
There has been a few past threads on this. Shop around is always a good idea. EAA use to have good prices. I know when I checked with Avemco a few years ago, they seemed to price their self as to say they were sour on insuring Experimental-Amateur Built (E-AB) kit airplanes. They may be competitive? Just my impression. I had insurance through EAA.

Does anyone want to share the premium they are paying?
> Liability only?
> Liability + Ground (hanger/ramp)?
> Comprehensive and on how much value?

Knowing what others would help in negotiating. I suspect insurance companies keep that info hard to obtain? You point out how quotes are blocked or known by other companies. This is something to discuss with your DC Representatives, State Attorney General and Insurance Commissioner. Not saying the Insurance Companies do anything wrong, but to my layman ear it sounds like PRICE FIXING at worst. When companies try to raise rates by colluding it seems suspicious and would be highly illegal. Airplane insurance is a small niche market compared to automobiles.

When you say 25% rate increase, in defense of Insurance Companies it could represent real world cost. The models you mention are very popular, and the price of RV's has sky rocketed. So the Insurance Premium may just reflect the higher build cost and replacement values RV's today? (OR the Insurance Companies are increasing their profit)

An RV-3, RV-4 or RV-6 in Mid/late 1980's, the standard was DAY/Night VFR 150-160HP with fixed wood prop and DIY paint. People could finish a RV between $30K to $40K with used engine out of a wind damaged C-172. Now the new standard is high HP, FI, CS prop, IFR Autopilot Glass panel, custom paint. Also many RV's are now not built but bought on the used market, so the labor cost is somewhat is built into the cost. I don't recommend undervaluing your RV when you insure it to save some money. It is best to value it at replacement cost. However you will pay more.
 
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There has been a few past threads on this. Shop around is always a good idea. .

Not necessarily. As the OP noted, some insurance companies have grown tired of issuing multiple quotes for the same pilot, and will only respond to the first request. Shop around for the best AGENCY to work for you (this is mostly word of mouth, what you read here, what feels like a good personal fit, etc), then let them do their job. Only exception is AVEMCO, which does not use agencies. Write them directly, they may send you a nice cap.
For the record I use Gallagher and like their service.
 
I find this very curious.... If you get an invoice, it's for one year of insurance. You pay the invoice in full. You now have a completed contract. A one year contract. How can the underwriter or agent increase the price at will, changing the completed contract.
 
I find this very curious.... If you get an invoice, it's for one year of insurance. You pay the invoice in full. You now have a completed contract. A one year contract. How can the underwriter or agent increase the price at will, changing the completed contract.

This post was directed to unbound policies or policies coming up for renewal. Once you bind coverage for a new policy or renewal, the price is set for the length of the term. When its time to renew the policy, the insurance company is able to implement any rate changes for the new term.
 
My insurance went down this year, not much though. Since I was expecting it to go up, I was happy. I use Gallagher.
 
I suspect insurance companies keep that info hard to obtain? You point out how quotes are blocked or known by other companies. This is something to discuss with your DC Representatives, State Attorney General and Insurance Commissioner. Not saying the Insurance Companies do anything wrong, but to my layman ear it sounds like PRICE FIXING at worst. When companies try to raise rates by colluding it seems suspicious and would be highly illegal. Airplane insurance is a small niche market compared to automobiles.

By blocked, I believe she means that the company will only quote your proposed rate to one broker and will then block other brokers from getting another quote for you. This is simply to avoid wasted work having to provide the same quote over and over as the customer shops across multiple brokers, all using the same handfull of companies. It seems the industry standard is to quote the same rate to all brokers, without preferential treatment. Don't see how this is collusion or price fixing. It is really there perogative to decide whether to provide you a quote or how many different times they will do it, just as it is your perogative not to buy from them.

For reasons like this, I choose my broker carefully and I use Gallagher. You want to think of these folks as your agent. Shop them based upon their experience/knowledge and not on price. Price shopping is done with the carriers and the price is not agent dependant, as it is for some other, more widely used, insurance products.

For the OP, I bound my 10 insurance in Nov and it was a good bit higher than the rate I was quoted over the summer, but can't remember how much. Maybe 10% I had 0 time in the 10, so my data doesn't help as much. I renewed the 6A in August and it went up a few dollars, but generally insignficant.

Larry
 
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I just renewed mine. $1445, about the same as last year. Went thru the Falcon agency in Kerrville, Texas. They put me with Global. I'm 77. RV 8. Is that about what you other 8 drivers are paying?
 
I just renewed mine. $1445, about the same as last year. Went thru the Falcon agency in Kerrville, Texas. They put me with Global. I'm 77. RV 8. Is that about what you other 8 drivers are paying?

It depends on a lot of things but I paid $1235 for my RV-8 in January 2020
 
There has been a few past threads on this. Shop around is always a good idea. EAA use to have good prices. I know when I checked with Avemco a few years ago, they seemed to price their self as to say they were sour on insuring Experimental-Amateur Built (E-AB) kit airplanes. They may be competitive? Just my impression. I had insurance through EAA.
.

We had avemco on a sr22t at a out 6300 a year, which was at least a couple Grand less than anyone else. That seems common across the cirrus market. I have asked for quotes on experimentals and I agree with you, they seem to avoid them if at all possible. Seems like some are competitive in some markets and not others
 
We had avemco on a sr22t at a out 6300 a year, which was at least a couple Grand less than anyone else. That seems common across the cirrus market. I have asked for quotes on experimentals and I agree with you, they seem to avoid them if at all possible. Seems like some are competitive in some markets and not others

Makes me glad I have the RV. That premium covers all my fixed costs plus a good 60hrs of flight time.
 
28% increase for a June renewal for my RV-10 through Falcon. Will be calling to find other options if possible.
 
Call Denise Porter 760-519-8605 or [email protected] . She got me thousands $$ less on my gyroplane, my T-41a, and now my RV-8. She’s real good with experimentals and got me a $256 discount when I renewed my policy this year with Old Republic.
 
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Last year, I used the AOPA recommended agency. This year, quoted through Gallagher, increased the value another $30,000, and the policy was $30 cheaper than last year. :cool:

7000 TT, 150 in type..
 
I noticed that too when I requested a quote. AOPA would be $40 more expensive than the other quote with the same underwriter. I guess they have to get a little chunk of everything. I continue to be an AOPA member for their pilot insurance but I don’t buy their aircraft insurance.
 
i just renewed the insurance with Global thru Gallagher. From last year
it went up 9.5% for exactly the same coverage. My 8A has been flying for
11 years now and the rates today are still much better than 6 or 7 years ago
(same coverage, but with AIG). YMMV
 
We've noticed a few posts about people shopping for insurance and wanted to send a friendly reminder that all brokers get the same quotes. That's as long as the same information is given to the insurance company. Instead of shopping for insurance, make sure you are with a broker you can trust to shop for you at every renewal.

Below is a link to a previous post about this that offers more details.
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?p=1257362#post1257362
 
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