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To Tailwheel or not to Tailwheel

rockitdoc

Well Known Member
Sponsor
Tailwheel easier to build?
More legroom up front?
Visibility in -14?
Lighter?
Faster?
Economy?

I'm mostly (95%) going into and out of paved runways, so no real advantage, unless it's easier, leg roomier, visibility isn't impaired, lighter, faster, and uses less fuel.

Corse I've never flown one, so that's another reason to do it!

Any MAJOR downsides to tailwheel besides risk of nose-over on hard braking?

Thanks,

Scott
 
I think most people worry about ground loop more than nose over. I believe that is the reason for increased insurance rates for low time tailwheel pilots. If I was you I'd get some dual instruction in a tailwheel, maybe a Citabria if you can find it.
That being said I fly an RV6 and am building an RV8, I do have a lot of tail dragger time, but an RV is not a really hard tailwheel airplane to fly.
 
I think most people worry about ground loop more than nose over. I believe that is the reason for increased insurance rates for low time tailwheel pilots. If I was you I'd get some dual instruction in a tailwheel, maybe a Citabria if you can find it.
That being said I fly an RV6 and am building an RV8, I do have a lot of tail dragger time, but an RV is not a really hard tailwheel airplane to fly.

Good to know.
 
Definitely tail wheel

Definitely build the tailwheel version. Have you seen the two? The tailwheel version looks like it?s going 200 knots just sitting there, yet the nose wheel version looks like it would be right at home with a ?student driver? banner across the windshield and a handicap permit hanging from the rear view mirror! Take some tailwheel lessons and learn to really fly. I would be more afraid of nose overs in the a models...
 
Tail Wheel. It is faster, lighter, cheaper, better on rough fields and will make you a better pilot.
Your learning new building skills why not new flying skills.
 
So you got some subjective opinion, here is the objective one


Nose wheel
Pros:
- Cheaper insurance
- Easier/safer to handle during x-wind landing
- Better visibility during taxing (safer)
- No concern about nose wheel like it is with 6/7/8/9 (entirely different nose wheel

Cons:
- Heavier by around 15-20 lb
- slower by around 2 or 3knots

P.S. the chance of nose over with hard breaking exist for the tail dragger not the nose dragger. A friend of mine did just that during taxing and had to do a tear down/new prop with his rocket.
 
So you got some subjective opinion, here is the objective one


Nose wheel
Pros:
- Cheaper insurance
- Easier/safer to handle during x-wind landing
- Better visibility during taxing (safer)
- No concern about nose wheel like it is with 6/7/8/9 (entirely different nose wheel

Cons:
- Heavier by around 15-20 lb
- slower by around 2 or 3knots

P.S. the chance of nose over with hard breaking exist for the tail dragger not the nose dragger. A friend of mine did just that during taxing and had to do a tear down/new prop with his rocket.

I hear Rockets are prone to tip because the long nose and heavy engine. .other than that, I don't think regular RVs are prone to nose over. .have you seen that recently posted video where the nose gear breaks off? I haven't seen the nose gear on the 14 in person, but I cringe whenever I see an "A" model RV. They are supposed to be tailwheel! Now if only we could get Van to offer a tailwheel 10!
 
I hear Rockets are prone to tip because the long nose and heavy engine. .other than that, I don't think regular RVs are prone to nose over. .have you seen that recently posted video where the nose gear breaks off? I haven't seen the nose gear on the 14 in person, but I cringe whenever I see an "A" model RV. They are supposed to be tailwheel! Now if only we could get Van to offer a tailwheel 10!

The nose gear design of a 14A is the same as the nose gear of a 10, if you have seen a 10, then you have seen the nose gear of a 14
 
Scott,
There are some good points made here as outlined by Mehrdad. This subject is like one of those religious discussions and you are never going to get a unbiased answer. It truly is a personal decision. In my opinion, it has nothing to do with pilot capability. I've seen some great pilots in formation teams that have incredible stick and rudder skills who fly nose wheel RVs and I respect their skill level. Of course they can learn to fly tail draggers, they just choose not to fly them based on personal preferences. It's like asking someone why they rather drive a 911 than a Corvette. Well you're going to get about a million reasons and most of those reasons are personal preference or beliefs.

From my experience, a tail dragger of any kind requires constant attention on the ground. There is a saying that you learn when you first become a tail wheel pilot, " you fly a tail dragger until you put it up in the hangar "..... you will adhere to this rule until you stop flying tail draggers. When I flew my RV-10 I can honestly say that I was more relaxed during taxi, take off and touch down. However, I believe that the stick and rudder experience that I had flying numerous tail draggers gave me more confidence and skills to be able to be relaxed while controlling a nose wheel during those phases of flight. I fly a -7, and a modified SuperCub on a daily basis and just sold my -10. Make no mistake, the minute I "relax" on the ground with the -7 or the SuperCub I will get myself in trouble.

So base your decision on what you desire. If you look at a tail dragger and think to yourself, "man that is cool" then learn to fly one and you will never want to go back to flying a nose wheel (<-- Again, personal preference).


So you got some subjective opinion, here is the objective one


Nose wheel
Pros:
- Cheaper insurance
- Easier/safer to handle during x-wind landing
- Better visibility during taxing (safer)
- No concern about nose wheel like it is with 6/7/8/9 (entirely different nose wheel

Cons:
- Heavier by around 15-20 lb
- slower by around 2 or 3knots

P.S. the chance of nose over with hard breaking exist for the tail dragger not the nose dragger. A friend of mine did just that during taxing and had to do a tear down/new prop with his rocket.
 
14 or 14A

Personally I love my 14, but I fly a taildragger by choice. Most people would say a taildragger is better for unimproved strips; however, the 14 vs 14A is not the same as the 7 vs 7A or 6 vs 6A.

The 14A main gear and nosegear are a significant departure from previous models. Although I love my 14, I suspect the 14A is a stronger design for grass strips because of the main gear. The nose gear is also an improved design.

Basically, build what you want to fly.
 
I have owned many airplanes from Bonanza, Baron, C-421, King Airs, MU-2, Lear, L-39 and quite a few more. They all had nose wheels. I decided on an RV9 to learn new skills and have fun doing it. I had some, very little, tailwheel time many many years ago. I am happy with my decision. The taildragger is definitely more challenging but isn?t the challenge part of the fun?
I have landed my 9 in a 30 knot direct gusting crosswind. And it wasn?t as difficult as I thought it might be. I have also, on one occasion, got lax and hit the brakes a tad too aggressively and felt the tailwheel come off the ground. Lesson learned there.
It is without doubt a personal decision, tailwheel or trike. For me, with my wife?s encouragement, the taildragger was and still is the right decision. And they look so cool as well.
 
Don't forget the resale value, you will get more money for an A model because the demand is greater. Your spouse may be more comfortable flying this model also because there is not to many white scarf spouses. Spouses like to see where they are going, especially on the ground.
 
In 2014 I took a intro flight in Vans' 9A at Oshkosh then on the edge between a 7 and a 14, both tail draggers; more than half of my total time since starting in '65 is tail wheel time.

The 9A intro pilot was a 7 builder and told me that he was currently changing his 7 to a 7A and emphasized the better over-the-nose view that the 9A had.

I think that the 14 looks better both sitting on the ground and in the air - more airplane-like; I went with the 14A because it might be easier to find a buyer when I have to sell it, and the 14 to 14A top speed is inconsequential - you won't be running it at top cruise very often or at all ever.

A negative is that the insurance will likely be higher in a tail dragger vs. for a nose dragger.
 
The cost of insurance is one thing. Why pay more than you need to.

I heard insurance wasn't available for experimentals. I guess this is incorrect?

First off, build the plane you want, not the plane others want you to build. The rest will sort itself out.

It has been my experience that initially, insurance for having the little wheel in back is more than the same aircraft with a nosewheel, but only for the first 100 hours or so. Then it equals out. So insurance shouldn't be part of the equation.

As others have said, get some tailwheel time and see what you think. The truth is, it takes about 10 hours of instruction to get the endorsement. (Some more, some less.) At about four hours of training you will be convinced you can't land the bloody thing then it will just "click" and you will spend the rest of the time refining your skills.

It will take a little while, say 100 hours in type, until you are really comfortable and do not fear the crosswind but that is true regardless of the location of the little wheel. BTW, if you are like most of us, that 100 hours will pass in less than a year, a year of fun flying!

(Like Angelo, I too have landed in extremely strong crosswinds, up to 32 knots, and revel in the challenge.)

Good luck with your choice.
 
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I don't recall ever owning a nosewheel. That said, the lucky among us get older, and slower. Although I find the tailwheel 14 to be a pussycat, and I adore Marvin's "big wheel" 14, I would probably opt for the 14A were I to build another RV. It's an attractive, low stress ride with very good resale.

Meanwhile, over in the other seat, I suspect the level attitude would make cabin access a whole lot easier for ladies of a certain age.
 
Jeff, Yes the 2-3 knots is inconsequential and I personally way prefer the tail drager but....I run my airplane WOT in cross country cruise about 95% of the time. I suspect many others do the same.
 
I fly my 14A at 170 kts most of the time. 2 - 3 kts gained in a tail wheel would be about 2%, which works out to a little over 1 minute per hour of flight. I don?t know about your time constraints, but that difference is invisible to me. :rolleyes:
 
I on the other hand aim to see how frugally I can fly. Most of my x-country flying is up high and usually around 160-162knots where I burn 7.5G. If I aim to go at 170knots, I most likely will have to make another stop for fuel which makes the overall trip actually longer and my pocket thinner.
 
I on the other hand aim to see how frugally I can fly. Most of my x-country flying is up high and usually around 160-162knots where I burn 7.5G. If I aim to go at 170knots, I most likely will have to make another stop for fuel which makes the overall trip actually longer and my pocket thinner.

Good point, but my biological limit is about 3 hours, so . . . ;)
 
I on the other hand aim to see how frugally I can fly. Most of my x-country flying is up high and usually around 160-162knots where I burn 7.5G. If I aim to go at 170knots, I most likely will have to make another stop for fuel which makes the overall trip actually longer and my pocket thinner.

 
Style Points

If we are all honest with each other, we'll admit that the only real reason for building a tailwheel version of any Van's aircraft is looks, ego, and those all important style points!

How many tailwheel airliners do you see out on the ramp today? There is a reason the answer is ZERO.

I love my RV-8 and wouldn't have it any other way. I'm a retired Fighter Pilot, so style points are important to me!
 
If we are all honest with each other, we'll admit that the only real reason for building a tailwheel version of any Van's aircraft is looks, ego, and those all important style points!

How many tailwheel airliners do you see out on the ramp today? There is a reason the answer is ZERO.

I love my RV-8 and wouldn't have it any other way. I'm a retired Fighter Pilot, so style points are important to me!

+1. for honesty. I think it's Shakespeare, "To thine own self be true". Or as everyone else says, "Build what you want".
 
I personally find the tail wheel airplane more challenging and fun and also prefer the looks. took up flying to challenge myself. I flew antiques that required much more skill than an RV, so stepping back to a nose wheel just won’t happen for me.
Tailwheel airplanes open up an entire new regime of landing and ground handling techniques, especially in tough conditions.

If you want to challenge yourself throughout your flying “career”, and enjoy more learning and honing of skill sets.... tailwheel it will be.

Personally, I don’t get the ego argument. I wanted, and want, the challenge for myself. Anybody making this kind of choice based on ego is probably going to be a statistic someday....
 
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If we are all honest with each other, we'll admit that the only real reason for building a tailwheel version of any Van's aircraft is looks, ego, and those all important style points!

How many tailwheel airliners do you see out on the ramp today? There is a reason the answer is ZERO.

I love my RV-8 and wouldn't have it any other way. I'm a retired Fighter Pilot, so style points are important to me!

I disagree about the ego or style points. Looks, yes. I love the way the tailwheel version looks, and hate how the nosewheel version looks. But the tailwheel versions are more fun to takeoff and land, more versatile, faster, lighter, more challenging (which make it more rewarding) to fly. I would not turn down a nosewheel 172 or 182.. they have their place, but I don?t get the point of an ?a? model RV, or the nosewheel carbon cub thing. I hope someone buys that carbon cub abomination and converts it back to conventional gear!
 
I disagree about the ego or style points. Looks, yes. I love the way the tailwheel version looks, and hate how the nosewheel version looks. But the tailwheel versions are more fun to takeoff and land, more versatile, faster, lighter, more challenging (which make it more rewarding) to fly. I would not turn down a nosewheel 172 or 182.. they have their place, but I don?t get the point of an ?a? model RV, or the nosewheel carbon cub thing. I hope someone buys that carbon cub abomination and converts it back to conventional gear!

That's what it is, a personal taste and preference. I personally don't like the look of a tail dragger, don't see the appeal at all but that is my taste in looks and does not make it right or wrong.
 
If we are all honest with each other, we'll admit that the only real reason for building a tailwheel version of any Van's aircraft is looks, ego, and those all important style points!

How many tailwheel airliners do you see out on the ramp today? There is a reason the answer is ZERO.

I love my RV-8 and wouldn't have it any other way. I'm a retired Fighter Pilot, so style points are important to me!

For me it was all about flying antiques and hopefully warbirds.

Over the years I have logged time in some amazing aircaft that I couldn't have flown, if I didn't have a logbook of tailwheel time.

Since I am a hobby pilot, I don't care about airliners or business jets or modern fighters, for that matter. Give me something that leaks oil, has some fabric on it someplace, and I'm all over it.
 
I think the tailwheel discussion is like the manual transmission verses the automatic transmission argument for sports cars. No doubt the modern automatics are better than 99.9% of the manuals. There is however a great satisfaction when you nail a perfect downshift heading into a corner, rev matching at just the right RPM ect. You never get that feeling driving a automatic.
It?s the same with a tailwheel. When you roll that wheel landing on and smoothly lower the tail to the runway staying dead on centerline it?s a feeling you just can?t get with a nosewheel. I can stay in the pattern all day having fun in a tailwheel aircraft. Two touch and goes in a nosewheel aircraft and I am bored and ready to do something else.
G
 
One of those never ending debates <g>.

Build what you think you want and figure out how to fly it later would be my .02. I didn't have a pilot's license when I started construction of my RV-6 twenty some odd years ago. I got my TW endorsement in an RV-6 before mine flew.

It was an afternoon, and no real biggie. Just another skill set that you add to the stack.

I will say that 20 years later when I'm doing my first V1 cut in a sim, I think all that TW time helped. My feet were dancing by habit already. :)

Go with your gut and learn during the journey.

Go get um and best of luck!!!!

v/r,dr
 
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Tailwheel easier to build?
More legroom up front?
Visibility in -14?
Lighter?
Faster?
Economy?

I'm mostly (95%) going into and out of paved runways, so no real advantage, unless it's easier, leg roomier, visibility isn't impaired, lighter, faster, and uses less fuel.

Corse I've never flown one, so that's another reason to do it!

Any MAJOR downsides to tailwheel besides risk of nose-over on hard braking?

Thanks,

Scott

I can't believe you asked around here! Do you fancy blonds or brunettes? You really go wrong with either, just one is a lot better looking, sexier, and and has the cool factor. You've got to live with her and look at her every day, so you decide.
 
Corse I've never flown one, so that's another reason to do it!

Any MAJOR downsides to tailwheel besides risk of nose-over on hard braking?

Thanks,

Scott

Scott. Go buy a used Luscombe 8A for about $12K and get your taildragger on. That would be a great way to test the waters. Find a competent seasoned tailwheel instructor. Seriously, you can't buy a nice used Harley for that! And Luscombes are a hoot to fly.
 
Let's specify which Rocket. HRIIs are prone to nose over. F1 Rockets are not. The F1s have a different gear geometry with the tires slightly forward.
 
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