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Age-related Insurance restrictions

gossend

Well Known Member
I just turned 75, flying an RV 12 under basic med. The subject of age-related insurance restrictions came up at lunch today, so I thought I would throw it out there. The comment was made that global aerospace, for one, will routinely increase Restrictions on flying as you get older. As a matter of policy AIG, for example, does not. I'm currently looking for renewal and I think I should be concerned about this. Does anyone have a qualified perspective on the subject?
 
When you say "Restrictions on Flying"... what does that refer to? I suspect insurance company will not write policy based on age?
 
Restrictions such as flying only with CFI, liability coverage only, etc. Not to mention, sky-high rate quotes.
Reportedly, some underwriters are more aggressive about this than others.
 
Other possible restrictions: Flight Review every year, Class III (or above medical), no complex aircraft, etc. This came from ABS magazine.
 
Age-related insurance costs

I am 89.5 years old and fly an RV-12 with Global insurance...no restrictions...I did not ask for nor want hull insurance, just liability and hangar damage coverage (a local requirement)....no problems, no special requirements..annual cost about $900
 
I have a friend that's a retired airline capt., 10's of thousands of hours, every rating, never filed a claim, never had an FAA problem, active pilot... Had an extraordinary C-210T that he owned and flown for many years.. When he hit 84 his insurance went from $2K a year to $10K a year for no reason. He had to sell his C-210T.
 
Back when we were in the LSA sales & manufacturing business, we lost a few sales because potential customers were over 80 and could not get insurance for their new airplane. The kicker seemed to be a lapse in coverage. If they had sold their previous airplane and cancelled their insurance, it was almost impossible to get another policy for their new plane. But if they were continuously insured, for some reason that was usually OK. (NOT always.)

It's terrible to put people under blanket restrictions like that solely based on age. I'd say, if they want twelve-month flight reviews, fine. But don't do it because of another birthday. :(
 
In the early 90s I had about 1,000 hours total time with no HP/Complex sign off. I bought a Yak 52. My choices were $2,000 a year for liability and hull coverage or $300 for just liability. At the time I was paying $1,000 for hull and liability on my Cherokee. I learned that extent of coverage makes a huge difference in premium. BTW at 68 I still pay $1,000 per year for the same Cherokee coverage and about the same for the RV-12 for same coverage. I added ratings along the way since 1990, so that is probably a factor in the stability of my premiums.
 
In the early 90s I had about 1,000 hours total time with no HP/Complex sign off. I bought a Yak 52. My choices were $2,000 a year for liability and hull coverage or $300 for just liability. At the time I was paying $1,000 for hull and liability on my Cherokee. I learned that extent of coverage makes a huge difference in premium. BTW at 68 I still pay $1,000 per year for the same Cherokee coverage and about the same for the RV-12 for same coverage. I added ratings along the way since 1990, so that is probably a factor in the stability of my premiums.

Recently told by two insurance companies to expect future year increases regardless of age due to industry hits from natural disasters.
 
Not necessarily a qualified perspective Dick, as you know I have been lying for 50 years, never even a parking ticket, and at 82 I found insurance priced beyond all reason, and mostly not even available. Made me bitter at first, then I finally accepted it, after all I flew for a number of years without ANY insurance, so I really do have an option if I wanted to use it.
 
Not necessarily a qualified perspective Dick, as you know I have been lying for 50 years, never even a parking ticket, and at 82 I found insurance priced beyond all reason, and mostly not even available. Made me bitter at first, then I finally accepted it, after all I flew for a number of years without ANY insurance, so I really do have an option if I wanted to use it.
Yep, I did the same and got away with it. I did have a prop strike that required major engine work, but by that time the engine was at TBO and the prop blades were np longer overhaulable, so insurance wouldn't have helped so much! I still came out way ahead.
I'm not recommending that you "go naked" - that's a risk decision for the young and invincible... Now, I'm older (and maybe smarter) - just sayin'
 
Age

Bill Harrelson, age 68, just completed an unofficial around the world speed record in class in the Lancair 4. Just five legs, longest 32:10, eight days total.
Age is absolutely, totally meaningless.
 
Age

Dick Rutan is 81, Van is 80. I bet they both have an opinion on the Insurance/age nonsense, along with many others.
John Miller flew solo in his Bonanza until age 99. Others allegedly have flown solo as old as 105.
 
After reading these posts, I?m wondering what the insurance companies are thinking, and what their goals are. A couple years ago I joined the ranks of ?senior citizen? (north of 65). It seems like they don?t want or need our business. When you consider the advancing age of the certified pilot group it seems like they aren?t really interested in insuring GA airplanes anymore. Not including senior citizens (unless they pay exorbitant rates), will quickly lead to the younger generation of pilots sharing the risk among a much smaller group that has, as a group, less experience. That raises their rates. Financially locking out the most experienced group of pilots in our country is a move that makes no sense, unless they really just don?t want to do business with non-corporate GA business any more. The only alternative may be liability only insurance, but that will be short lived too, because the younger generation won?t be able to afford a big hull loss. They understand that seniors own most of the wealth in our country. I don?t mean we are multi-millionaires, I mean we, as a group, have lots of cash built up in IRA?s, 401K?s, etc collectively, and liability coverage makes more sense for them when you consider our track record on aircraft accident litigation.
 
Plan B - Liability Only

When I got my Aerostar, the Insurance folks wouldn?t even give me the time of day. It was NO before I could make a case. So, liability only it is. On my -9, no problem getting coverage but I?m still a tad south of retirement age still. I was told off the record that the day will come when a new birthday will alter my coverage options.

I wonder if ?age discrimination? in the insurance industry will ever be challengered? Raising a rate solely based on another trip around the sun seems lame to me.
 
Insurance

I am 80 my insurance Co. still insures my RV-6 I have been expecting a rate increase but so far so good. I am sure its coming that's why the RV is for sale.
EV
 
Disclosure: I just turned 71, and I don?t work for an insurance company.
In the US, insurance companies are in business to make money. The sad fact is, many of us know pilots who are too old but still flying. Some are too old at 70, some at 100. The insurance companies do the best they can to make money. Insurance tends to be an averaging business, and as some people age worse, they drag down the rest.
 
Not intended to encourage thread drift, but other factors start working against older pilots as well. I found with the newer BFR rules, a CFI feels he is really going out on a limb to sign off on a BFR on an "older" pilot, for fear that if he ever had a mishap, the CFI would be held accountable. I got some flimsy excuses like "I don't do a BFR in any Experimental, or Light Sport planes, or with instruments that are not round, or on pilots that are old". I have even seen some "milk" the system for money, require 10 or more hours of dual, only in their plane, then claim the person was "not ready yet" I was young once and viewed older people the same way I guess, when you are in your 20s, you only think of someone who is 82 as only an authority on dinosaurs.
 
Have you guys worked through EAA or AOPA? One thing I have heard is that once you get a quote it prejudices others, but that might be urban legend. I have insured five experimentals (3 EAB, 1 ELSA and 1 Russian trainer experimental exhibition). I started with EAA each time and got what I consider reasonable rates.
 
Age-related Insurance Restrictions

My answer is first, find a competent insurance broker that represent all the major insurance companies. Then tell hem/her everything about the way your use and fly your airplane. When you go to a doctor for a complete physical exam, you completely undress and the Dr. has unrestricted access to your body to evaluate your health. When you go to your insurance broker, you must do a complete financial and aviation use undressing and give him complete access to all the data on how you use your aircraft. Who flies your aircraft? Does a non-owner pilot compensate you in any way for flying your airplane. Do any of the pilots do any kind of aerobatics? Is the aircraft flown internationally. Does any pilot fly the aircraft in waivered airspaced. Is the aircraft used for training. Tell all these facts and more. Then you are ready to ask the broker to begin getting you quotes for insurance from all the companies that insure your type aircraft and your type of use. Once you get those quotes, you can evaluate all responses and make sense of them. Don't just take what you overheard some other pilot say happened to him as gospel.
 
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