What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

ADS-B Public Report problem

hevansrv7a

Well Known Member
I installed a uAvionix Echo UAT which was pre-mounted and pre-configured on a GRT Safe-Fly 2020 GPS.

It appears to be working correctly including via WiFi on an iPhone and an iPad on FlyQ and ForeFlight respectively. Both show other traffic, etc. The traffic reports agree with my Zaon PCAS, too.

After two flights for which the "public report" came back saying no record, on my third attempt I contacted Detroit Approach and asked if they could see my ADS-B. They could. I was just outside the veil at more than 3000 AGL.

The public report request came back "no report" again. I responded as they suggested to the email address it provided and gave all the data including the remark that ATC could see my ADS-B.

The reply to my email ignored that I told them ATC could see it and said the my device is not transmitting.

I have a call in to the local FSDO (left message of course).

Anyone have any relevant experience or tech advice to share? THANKS.
 
I had a similar issue with the same unit upon my install. You are likely sending and receiving info but its not being tied to your N number. I cant recall the specifics of the fix, but go through the uavionix set up steps checking for places where you enter info that identifies your plane. I recall that there are more than one instances of this in the data entry. Good luck

erich
 
Also make sure you aren't in the "anonymous" mode. That will result in a "no report", as well.
 
Sensitivity

No report means your transponder pairing with echo is no there. Call uavionics and get them to help you turn up sensitivity on device. No report means squawk and no attitude reporting seen by FAA
 
Alll good ideas but all done already

When I talked to Detroit approach they where seeing both my ADS-B and my transponder and, obviously, were able to see that they were the same airplane. They were also seeing my correct altitude from my transponder.

I had already confirmed that my tail number, ICAO were configured and that I was not in anonymous mode. I made some of those and other configuration errors in the earlier flights.

My plan now is to take it to an avionics shop and spent the $$ to check it on the ground, get that report and put it in my log.
 
No report means your transponder pairing with echo is no there. Call uavionics and get them to help you turn up sensitivity on device. No report means squawk and no attitude reporting seen by FAA

If this is for N17HH, I can tell you that tail number and code (A1178B) has never generated any hits in the FAA system for ADS-B. I somewhat question the information that Detroit Approach gave you.

Next time you fly, in ForeFlight, press More (lower right hand corner), choose Devices, and click your Echo UAT. About halfway down the page, depending on the iPad screen size that you have, you should see “Ownship.” Is if detected or not? If yes, your ADS-B is working. If it isn’t, then your ADS-B isn’t working.
 
Last edited:
Since you're able to receive traffic on your iPad, you've at least confirmed that your echoUAT is powered and that the 978 antenna is connected to the transceiver.

If as @SPX says that no hits have been received by the FAA system, start with the easy stuff: make sure the echo is configured with the right N-number and ICAO code. You said you've done this, but it's good to double check that you haven't fat-fingered anything.

Fire up the uAvionix Echo Installer app next time you're at the plane and check the top few lines on the "Configuration" tab. It should look like this:

Zb2ZSTs.png


"ICAO Number" is a six-digit hex code starting with "A", and "Call Sign" should be your full N-number (including the N).

Also note the position of the pick menus for Control (UAT TX Enabled) and Anonymous Mode (Disabled).

Save your settings, then hop over to the "Monitor" tab. You should see something like this, with the call sign (e.g. N17HH) and address (A1178B) you previously entered.

qYHKgnE.png


If those are present, then take a look at Squawk, Pressure Altitude, Latitude / Longitude, and NIC / NACp. Blanks or zeros for any of those indicate that something isn't communicating with the echoUAT. and give you your next step for troubleshooting.
 
My RV-12 buddy has never been able to pass the Public Report. He's fiddled with the sensitivity as instructed, and contacted uAvionics. All they said was that they're coming out with a software update. Sheesh...
 
No report means your transponder pairing with echo is no there. Call uavionics and get them to help you turn up sensitivity on device. No report means squawk and no attitude reporting seen by FAA

I don't think that is correct. If the Echo is transmitting the correct ICAO code and the correct N-number, you will get a report with Errors. If the sensitivity is wrong, you will get errors in Altitude.

A complete non-report is caused by other issues, usually in the setup.
 
I don't think that is correct. If the Echo is transmitting the correct ICAO code and the correct N-number, you will get a report with Errors. If the sensitivity is wrong, you will get errors in Altitude.

A complete non-report is caused by other issues, usually in the setup.

I concur, with the exception of if the sensitivity is wrong, you'll most likely get errors in the Mode 3/A column (because the Echo UAT does not know what your squawk code is), and possibly BARO altitude depending on your exact setup.
 
A quick look at your tail number on FlightAware seems to indicate your transponder is working while your ADS-B OUT is not.

:cool:
 
Last edited:
Thanks. I remember the serial cable fix. I don't think he's going to want to pull off his wing again, though. I'm not sure that cable is long enough to reach, anyway. The whole idea behind the SkyBeacon in the first place was that you didn't need to run a bunch of wires. I tried to talk him into installing a Garmin GDL-82, but n-o-o-o-o-o, he wanted the "easy" installation. Too bad it doesn't work. Well, I should qualify that statement. When the two of us were up flying a month ago, I could "see" his tail number as a target on my iPad. So his SkyBeacon is "working", it just fails Mode 3A.
 
Thanks. I remember the serial cable fix. I don't think he's going to want to pull off his wing again, though. I'm not sure that cable is long enough to reach, anyway. The whole idea behind the SkyBeacon in the first place was that you didn't need to run a bunch of wires. I tried to talk him into installing a Garmin GDL-82, but n-o-o-o-o-o, he wanted the "easy" installation. Too bad it doesn't work. Well, I should qualify that statement. When the two of us were up flying a month ago, I could "see" his tail number as a target on my iPad. So his SkyBeacon is "working", it just fails Mode 3A.

It may take some trial and error, but playing with the threshold setting and getting it right will make the SkyBeacon work, and will give off a good Mode 3/A value for the ADS-B performance report.

Also there's a SkyBeacon firmware update out that addresses the Mode 3/A problem.
 
...there's a SkyBeacon firmware update out that addresses the Mode 3/A problem.
Thanks. Hopefully my friend can figure out how to update the firmware. I think it requires a computer, not just a smart phone. The guy isn't very computer literate :rolleyes:
 
Most of the solution has been reached

First,
Some comments were quite correct and others simply did not give me credit for having done the obvious. Also, it's not a SkyBeacon.

To make the rest of the long story short, the Echo UAT was not retaining the configuration and was broadcasting my identify as "PingC251"on this last flight. ATC was correct that they could see me but did not bother to notice or tell me that they were not seeing my correct tail number. That caused a lot of the confusion. To make this even worse, the callsign was apparently randomly varied with each attempt or with each flight. A previous one was Ping2777 for example.

I spent some $$ at a good avionics shop to find this out. Then I contacted both uAvionix and GRT and both said that in SOME cases the iPhone app doesn't save the configuration when bluetooth and cellular data are turned on. Neither they nor I have any explanation for that.

I have not had time to check this solution yet. I suspect it is correct.

The avionics shop was able to see my ADS-B out all the way back to my home airport once they knew what "callsign" to look for. In other words, the device is working correctly EXCEPT that it is not retaining my correct identity configuration.

I hope that this helps anyone else trying to meet the FAA deadline at minimum cost. I like the device and it was easy to install. I have not yet tried to hard wire it to my EFIS so this is a minimum install: power, ground and two antennas, one of which (GPS) is included in the package. For now I plan to mount the iPhone on the panel for traffic. My EFIS is still using my Zaon PCAS which sees all Mode-C, even if the other airplane does not have ADS-B out.
 
I called my RV-12 buddy today to ask if he'd installed the firmware update for his SkyBeacon. He said "The FAA hasn't approved it yet." That can't be true, can it? Is this the one he needs? skyBeacon Software Upgrade to ADS-B 1.3.1 issued 6/1/2019.

Yes, that's the one. PM me for a phone number if your friend would like to talk this over. I dealt with the same problem on my RV-9A SkyBeacon, and have it resolved now and get perfect ADS-B performance reports.
 
For the UAT Echo I?ve found you MUST turn off all cellular data on your iPhone. Then turn on WiFi ONLY and connect to the Echo WiFi network and close all apps except for the Echo App.

If you do not turn off cellular data and close all EFB apps (ForeFlight, FltPlan-Go, Garmin Pilot, etc) any changes you make in the Echo App will look as if it?s correctly set up but will not take and will show as if you have not entered anything when the Echo device is powered down then powered back up.

I figured this out by trial and error, asking Uavionix and using several different devices with and without cellular data. After that step you can follow the normal directions and everything will work just fine. Definitely frustrating at first but it?s a simple step and everything works great afterwards. :)
 
Thanks for the updates -- it seems like you're getting things sorted.

To make the rest of the long story short, the Echo UAT was not retaining the configuration and was broadcasting my identify as "PingC251"on this last flight. ATC was correct that they could see me but did not bother to notice or tell me that they were not seeing my correct tail number. That caused a lot of the confusion. To make this even worse, the callsign was apparently randomly varied with each attempt or with each flight. A previous one was Ping2777 for example.

That is a likely indication that your echoUAT was transmitting in anonymous mode, and explains why you didn't generate a PAPR report: the data on your tail number from those flights wasn't bad; it didn't exist.

For anyone else playing along at home, anonymous mode changes three data elements in the UAT Out broadcasts:
  • Address Qualifier changes from 0 to 1, to tell the ground stations (and listening aircraft) that you are using a self-assigned address
  • Address changes from your 24-bit ICAO address to a pseudorandom self-assigned temporary code
  • Callsign is obfuscated

Different manufacturers handle callsign obfuscation differently. uAvionix replaces your N-number with a random "Pingxxxx" callsign. Garmin uses "VFR". IIRC, Navworx used "NONE".

Address randomization is done in accordance with the UAT spec for all manufacturers. This involves stacking the lower 12 bits of latitude and lower 12 bits of longitude taken at device startup, and XORing that against your ICAO address. Since lat and lon are both encoded such that 24 bits = 360?, a 1-bit change corresponds to a shift of 360/2^24 = 0.0000215?, or roughly 5-8 feet depending on latitude. In other words, if your initial GPS fix changes by more than 8 feet between subsequent startups, you get a different code.

in SOME cases the iPhone app doesn't save the configuration when bluetooth and cellular data are turned on
I had heard that as well, but didn't run into any issues with my cellular-enabled iDevices on iOS 12.3.1 with my echoUAT, which has a late June 2019 build date. Maybe I just got lucky. I did take care to check and double-check settings changes after hitting "save".

Incidentally, Stratux receivers (or any dump978-based receiver) make great tools for verifying ADS-B output or troubleshooting configuration issues because so much data is exposed to you on the setup / status pages. The "Traffic" status page in the web interface will give you most of the relevant bits of data that tend to trip up PAPR reports: ICAO code, callsign, squawk code, pressure altitude, and GPS position.
 
similar issue

Have been trying to get a FAA report for over a year now and have posted my problem here. Am taking my plane to an avionics shop on Monday to see if I can get it resolve. Tried to update my transceiver software Friday, but the error message was "failed to communicate with device". Anyone tried updated their echo?
 
Almost success

I followed the recommendation to put the iPhone in airplane mode, close all app and then turn on only wifi. That worked. My Echo UAT is now configured and is correctly broadcasting my aircraft's ICAO and registration along with all the other stuff.

However, my public report came back with two red boxes. uAvionix support has recommended two things:

1. make a flight that is designed to succeed. My flight was a lot of pattern work and never went above 3500 mil. Better would be higher and no steep turns or big altitude changes, etc.
2. some specific configuration changes, using the app.

That's next. So far, so good.
 
Awesome! Glad the WiFi only worked! If you ever choose to monitor the data in the echo app make sure you do the same thing. WiFi only, all cellular data off and close all EFB apps such as ForeFlight, FltPlan Go, WingX, etc.
 
OUCH !

Awesome! Glad the WiFi only worked! If you ever choose to monitor the data in the echo app make sure you do the same thing. WiFi only, all cellular data off and close all EFB apps such as ForeFlight, FltPlan Go, WingX, etc.

YMMV, but I grab my iPhone 6S and check via the monitor at cruise, never turn off Bluetooth, Cellular Data, with ForeFlight running. Would be a horrible piece of programming that required all that effort to use their monitor app IMHO.

Nevertheless, glad the issue was resolved for OP.
 
Echo configuration / setting

Remember the Transponder Threshold will have to be decreased by 100 until you get a steady pressure altitude seen from the Monitor page. Not sure if some are referring to the Transponder Threshold as the sensitivity. To get to the Transponder Threshold setting contact Uavionix to walk you through
 
YMMV, but I grab my iPhone 6S and check via the monitor at cruise, never turn off Bluetooth, Cellular Data, with ForeFlight running. Would be a horrible piece of programming that required all that effort to use their monitor app IMHO.

Nevertheless, glad the issue was resolved for OP.

As a retired programmer and manager of application development, I agree 100% that it's a very poorly developed/tested application in this case. Mine is also a 6s. There is no information (at least none that I have found) that defines when it's a problem and when it's not.

uAvionix, overall, have accomplished the "unthinkable" in avionics by shattering the price-performance barrier. Kudos exponentially for that. But they need to clean up their delivery and their documentation.
 
The latest from uAvionix tech support

Below here, find verbatim the email I received regarding my two red boxes on the public report. I want to draw your attention to the item #5 which apparently takes you to a secret page! My comments on their documentation are reinforced.
----------------------------------------------------------------
The guidance for performance of a test flight is to fly in an area with radar and ADSB coverage, at least 2000 feet AGL, avoid steep turns and avoid touch and go operations. One should fly at a single altitude and avoid steep climbs and descents.

Your report indicates that you probably should adjust your transponder threshold setting of the Echo using the application. The factory default is a value of 1550 and we having been finding that 1350-1400 is a good value to pass the certification test. Below are the instructions for adjusting the threshold. You may adjust the threshold in flight and using the monitor function in application can see the baro and mode 3A values populate when the threshold is set to the correct level.

Regards,
david wagner
uAvionix Technical Support
[email protected]
The threshold value adjusts the sensitivity of the echoUAT transponder monitor. Higher values reduce sensitivity, lower values increase sensitivity.

To modify the threshold value perform the following steps:

1. Turn the avionics master on.

2. Connect a mobile device to the echoUAT Wi-Fi.

3. Open the echo mobile application.

4. Verify the app shows "Connected to Device"



5. Tap two fingers simultaneously on the echo logo.


6. Scroll to the bottom of the app screen and find the Transponder Threshold values.


7. Change the Transponder Threshold by -100 and press Update Advanced
You can monitor the baro in flight when in radar coverage and adjust the threshold slightly until the baro value in the monitor mode is correct when interrogated.
 
At least early, experimental only version of skybeacon did NOT lock out adjusting in flight.

I believe the last 2 versions of software and the TSO'd units lock out adjustments after 5 minutes.

Not sure you can power cycle inflight to re-enable changing settings on the fly.
 
echoUAT + SKYFYX-ext and Garmin GTX327

I can confirm that Android OS device used to upload configuration to echoUAT needs to be in airplane mode (NO DATA) and connected via WiFi to echoUAT. If echo monitor callsign show PingXXXX then programming has failed. It has to show your N number.
 
Not sure you can power cycle inflight to re-enable changing settings on the fly.

Don't do that. It would be a violation of the regs to ever power cycle or turn off ADS-B out. In the air or on the ground. If the engine is running, no matter the location anywhere in the USA in flight or on the ground. Can generate an FAA nastygram. Ridiculous? Yes but the regs made by those paid by us.
 
Not quite, ............

Don't do that. It would be a violation of the regs to ever power cycle or turn off ADS-B out. In the air or on the ground. If the engine is running, no matter the location anywhere in the USA in flight or on the ground. Can generate an FAA nastygram. Ridiculous? Yes but the regs made by those paid by us.

The FAA has issued some changes to the original rule, which you state above. Formation flights are an exception. Only the lead aircraft must squawk their transponder and broadcast their ADS-B OUT. The wing aircraft may turn both the transponder and the ADSB-OUT completely off.

And I can't imagine a brief power-off recycle in an attempt to get something working again would result in a "nastygram".
 
Back
Top